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Loyalty?

topic posted Tue, April 1, 2008 - 10:01 AM by  IceStormRed
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I have a few friends that I would do just about anything for. When they need something, I'm there.

That got me wondering about what motivates such loyalty. Any thoughts? What is it that will give you that sense of loyalty to a friend?
posted by:
IceStormRed
Miami
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  • Re: Loyalty?

    Tue, April 1, 2008 - 10:08 AM
    a proven track record of them being trustworthy and just 'there' when i've needed 'em ...like , years and years of this I guess...
    • Unsu...
       

      Re: Loyalty?

      Tue, April 1, 2008 - 1:52 PM
      I dont wanna sound pathetic , but for me is love and respect. I love my friends and i would do anything for them (except for some extreme stuff like killing someone). So loyalty just comes natural for me, out of love. Also i am loyal to people i respect, so when i work for someone who treats me right and fair, and earn my respect, i am loyal
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        Re: Loyalty?

        Tue, April 1, 2008 - 2:29 PM
        Love, honesty and respect. BIG things! My Scorpio moon and IC need this as does my 8th house venus.
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          Re: Loyalty?

          Tue, April 1, 2008 - 5:41 PM
          I can generally divide them into three groups:

          1. Those who I would want on my team when playing volleyball

          2. Those I would bleed for

          3. The two who I would die for
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            Re: Loyalty?

            Tue, April 1, 2008 - 6:00 PM
            I have a taurus friend. The best friend anyone could ever have in the world. She never asks for anything. Always there when you need her and scarce when you don't. Has problems but will listen to yours first, just always puts the other one first. She is thoughtful in every way, remembers little things like what your fav lifesaver is and will pick up a bag of them while she's at the store. She's totally dependable and fixed in her routine when it comes to being a friend, like we go for an ice cream every Tuesday and she would fly from heaven not to miss it. She accepts people for who they are and attrubutes their hearts. I'd die for her in a minute..
            • Re: Loyalty?

              Sun, July 26, 2009 - 3:35 PM
              I´m always thinking about CONSISTENCY in social interaction, about what is said & done today, next week & the year after that. Do these actions fit together, almost like chain-links I can predict? I don´t like irrational behaviour & whims; there should be a pattern or I will become paranoid. My dealings with others are an ongoing evaluation of them in my head with scale & ruler: trustworthy or not?
              • Re: Loyalty?

                Sun, July 26, 2009 - 4:32 PM
                Once I am in love, be it friend or romance I am loyal to a fault..by expecting the same of others, I am incredibly nieve......
                I am the strong one when I have friends..never aloud to be human..when I have a problem or downturn..my "friends disapear" no one wants their strong person to be human or weak..I guess.
                Right now my life is way down..thus no communication from friends..few messages on tribe or e-mails or phone calls..family deserted me..but let me have an art show in NY and or teach college again..then suddenly I have "friends" by the zillions...but only a few chosen friends who resonate something I see in their soul I give my loyalty to.
                sometimes it is Karma? I don't know..when people leave..I say Karma complete..I thought I had life time friends till middle age..then people change..it is true what they say.."never trust anyone over 30 LOL joke but some truth in that..people over 30 become self centered busy with love or families...and more about the small pictures than the big pictures.
                Friends usually come together like chrystals..when circumstances are right or there is a joining factor or commonality..although I have had many friends whom I have not had one damn thing in common with.
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                Re: Loyalty?

                Sun, July 26, 2009 - 5:31 PM
                do you make or break friendships over one or two displeased inteactions? and when displeased, or distrusting, do you speak directly to the person that makes you feel that way? are you sure, absolutely, that you understand them completly, before you dismiss their actions or thots?
                do you throw out enouph of yourself, that you feel some outside person knows you well enouph, that you both have agreed upon and understanding of what trustworthy is? and your expectations, both directions, in a conversation? When you feel someone is not trustworthy- have you also lived up to your own expectation, but with yourself, of what you desire from others to come to your understanding of trust?

                ' Do these actions fit together, almost like chain-links I can predict?''

                come on Joakim, you know that can only be rhetorical - because you seem to be speaking about YOURSELF. only you know the answer to that, and i know you know that. or do you mean to make subtle meaning to someone in particular in saying that? What may seem like directness to one person, may not be understood to be so by another, i thinks. anyway, these are important thots to examine.
                What astrological connections do you make to loyalty? What does loyalty mean to you? not in a general sense, but a particular one.
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                  Re: Loyalty?

                  Sun, July 26, 2009 - 5:31 PM
                  @Joakim (above)
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Loyalty?

                    Sun, July 26, 2009 - 7:22 PM
                    I appreciate consistency in friend as well. I am flexible and understanding with friends but drastic inconsistent behaviors in friends might surprise me too much. A few things might bring change of behavior in people: alcohol, drug or love.
                    • Re: Loyalty?

                      Sun, July 26, 2009 - 8:07 PM
                      inc,: I was a mental health professional and also a counsilor..so to your questions...lol..what do you think.?
                      she asked a simple question about loyalty and it was like math ..algabra maybe but you took it to such a level as to be highly self analytical and a perfectionist but also want to know what others thin..funny did you know scorpios use friends and people as sounding boards?
                      So it is written.
                      Anywat Inc. , to answer your questions to each individual circumstance, and friendships and the dynamics of that friendship hold a unique answer pertaining to your questions..as each individual is given to his or her own personal lanquage...also many factors would have to be factored in to solve the equation notion of your questions asked..so like I said quite mathamatical
                      • Re: Loyalty?

                        Sun, July 26, 2009 - 8:10 PM
                        a confession...I am trustworthy..however, it has been my misfortune to have had friends that have not been...so I am jaded and don't trust too fast to soon..etc. Hard for me to trust anyone I have been so fucked over....but I work to keep my heart open and move on
                    • Re: Loyalty?

                      Mon, July 27, 2009 - 6:22 AM
                      "A few things might bring change of behavior in people: alcohol, drug or love. "

                      ...or guilt I would also include.

                      Many mystery writers employ this to their service. They create the 'red herring' character who acts so out of behaviour that the readers are left thinking "it must be him, he's acting so odd", only to find out at the end that he was in fact in love. If you pay attention to this you'll see that a quite a number of 'who dunnit' writers employ this technique.
                • Re: Loyalty?

                  Mon, July 27, 2009 - 5:02 AM
                  I was just "tickling" a little! And of course the whole thing was intentionally "hazed", just to sweeten things, for petite moi. There is, of course, always the possibility of misunderstanding, since no individual is all-seeing & all-knowing. As I stated somewhere before, Virgos are very disciplined & able/willing to swallow lots of sour lemons before it time to pack the bags. And the "trust-thing" has to run both ways; one cannot carp about trust-issues without having very strict principles one follows with none or few emergency exceptions. This is beginning to get too serious, it was not intended as a "barb", it was still the gnome teasing from behind his little mushroom-hut. Loyalty surely IS a Scorpio "thing"? Perhaps earth signs like bulls also will trot along even if the journey is headed to the abyss, but I imagine loyalty to be a scorpian "issue", one they are rather preoccupied with...
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Loyalty?

                    Mon, July 27, 2009 - 6:25 AM
                    "Loyalty surely IS a Scorpio "thing"? "

                    I think it is a 'fixed sign' thing, not necessarily scorpio alone. I think it depends on what you define as loyalty. I'd imagine that each of the elements view it differently but neither one would hold a monopoly on it. I do think that the fixed signs generally hold more stock by loyalty. There are of course pros and cons of each and neither is better than the other.
                    • Re: Loyalty?

                      Mon, July 27, 2009 - 3:36 PM
                      A sharp observation there mr Paul, I almost agree. But I think Scorps CRAVE loyalty in other ways than the rest, without that basic trust no one gets anywhere with old Scorpy. He wants you on his team; and that is no request, it´s a requirement. Most things are very PERSONAL in the land of the scorps. And maidens are supposed to be all flexible & flap around wherever the winds take them! I´m very unflexible when it comes to loyalty/trust-issues. In the past I´ve always supported doomed causes til the end in blizzards or rain if they were right & the other options were wrong.
                      • Re: Loyalty?

                        Tue, July 28, 2009 - 1:20 AM
                        "In the past I´ve always supported doomed causes til the end in blizzards or rain if they were right & the other options were wrong."

                        Do you have a lot of fixity in your chart? Regardless of which fixed sign, just the 'fixed' mode? Would be interesting to check it out.

                        I do think that Scorps crave a loyalty, but not necessarily any more than the other fixed elements, its just that most of us understand 'fixed emotion' easier than we do 'fixed ideas' like aquarius or 'fixed routine' like we do with taurus etc. I think as a society we place greater importance upon a certain degree of fixity in emotional exchanges - monogomy etc etc so the 'scorpio' energy is in some ways more easily recognised or understood, so we might think that it occurs more commonly in scorpio than the other fixed signs, but I don't really think this is true. It just might appear that way because having a ceratin degree of scorpio in our own charts (presumably) we 'notice' it in others quicker. Leo would demand or crave loyalty to their creative ventures, aquarius to their 'vision' or ideas etc etc. Loyalty and fixed signs go hand in hand, but for each one what exactly loyalty means is the thing that changes. For scorpio it means love. Emotional attachment right up to the last dying breath - normally love, but of course scorpio is also known for its legendary grudges and vengeance too which would always depend on the scorpio in question!

                        I'd also look to the angles. I think people with Fixed angles would relate to this to some degree, even if they had no planets in scorpio in because as soon as something transits one of the other angles, chances are it will be making an aspect to whatever angle is in scorpio, and, as well know, the angles are quite important when things transit them. Particularly I think someone with Taurus rising will experience similar feelings regarding loyalty (even if not expressed exactly the same) as would the scorpio chart, mainly because it would mean that Scorpio would rule their Descendant and their house of relationships and I think Scorpio on this house cusp can suggest difficult or emotionally painful experiences in love, or the fear of them.

                        I've made a great effort to 'not flog a dead horse' as the saying goes. I am very much loyal to people and for me a true sign of friendship is loyalty through the bad times. I think many scorpios (and other fixed signs) would understand this and it's no surprise to find all my angles occurring in the fixed element with 5 planets in fixity too. This is of course at odds with the more mutable and 'airy' parts of my chart and so my experience of it will obviously create an different dynamic to it than in others.
                        • Re: Loyalty?

                          Tue, July 28, 2009 - 2:37 AM
                          Perhaps Fixed =obsession
                          And Loyalty = faith=scorpios

                          Scorpios have obsessed demand for equal amount of faith in them as they have in friends, but this faith (loyalty) is tested through emergency, hardship or conflict.

                          Cancerian scorpios have strong faith in friends and theloyalty is the protective kind—never stop warning about the seductive singing of the Sirens.
                          • Re: Loyalty?

                            Tue, July 28, 2009 - 3:50 AM
                            "Scorpios have obsessed demand for equal amount of faith in them as they have in friends, but this faith (loyalty) is tested through emergency, hardship or conflict. "

                            Although I'm not quite sure that 'faith' is the correct word, I think I understand the point you're making. however, I'd go one step further with this and suggest that not only is the loyalty tested through emergency, hardship or conflict by some kind 'accident' or circumstance, but by the scorpio themselves. It seems to me that scorpio, more so than the other fixed signs (though not by much) will seek to 'test' the limits of the loyalty in minor ways and sometimes in major ways also. It is as though there is a NEED to know whether their friends, lover etc is being loyal. Often Scorpio gets 'mislabelled' as being manipulative or machiavellian for doing this - though of course there ARE the manipulative and machiavellian variety too where this compulsion seems to 'take over'. I think that Scorpio (and to a slightly lesser extent the other Fixed signs) need to test or sabotage their friendships in minor ways so that they KNOW whether or not the other person is truly loyal. Often this occurs through argument (seldom through disloyalty themselves obviously) or 'stubbornness' (another fixed trait obviously) and it can often be just a security blanket for them to ensure that their friend or lover or whatever won't fall apart when hard times come, as Scorpio (more so than the other Fixeds) KNOW will inevitably come along. It is something of a clever survival mechanism. Scorpio knows that there will be hard times and when there are hard times they may be somewhat more vulnerable than they might otherwise be, and they need to know now when that time comes whether you'll fall apart or whether you have the strength to weather it with him/her. Weather it is the key word - weather it, see it out, wait it out, resist it etc. but never give into it, never go around it, that is the way of the mutables, not the fixed. The fixed signs weather the hard times out, the mutables escape them and the cardinals seek to change them.

                            I like to not dissociate one side of an axis from the other and think in particular with this analogy, it is useful to consider Taurus also. Taurus is literally like a boulder in my mind and Scorpio a ravaging, thunderous ocean, with dark tempestuous waters and lightning claps and thunderstorms. I like to imagine that the boulder of Taurus is placed immutably in the onslaught of the crashing waves. The waves crash against the boulder, hitting it with everything it has and the boulder of taurus stays and weathers this onslaught out, sees every crash of the wave with equal passivity and steadfastness - these are the tests of scorpio. Scorpio needs a partner or friend etc that can surive and weather the dark tempests of their emotions. They need to know that when the time comes, you'll be there, you'll be steadfast by their side or even steadfast against their emotional outburst. They need to know that you wont' fall apart when the storm comes in.
                            • Re: Loyalty?

                              Tue, July 28, 2009 - 5:55 AM
                              What other sign is so fast & so furious when a great friendship suddenly turns sour for some reason? And why? Because of the betrayal, perhaps the worst offense in Scorpys black book (with skull-drawing on the jacket!). I was considered a "traitor" by a Libra (scorps in disguise) & that guy was still mad as hell when I met him 20 years later in life! That´s extreme stuff, the average Aquarian doesn´t react that way...
                              • Re: Loyalty?

                                Tue, July 28, 2009 - 7:10 AM
                                "That´s extreme stuff, the average Aquarian doesn´t react that way... "

                                Oh you've obviously not rubbished an Aquarian's 'dream' or 'vision' or 'ideas'. Aquarius is much more detached, it's true, however they hold strongly and firmly to their 'vision' and their ideas. Laugh at an Aquarian who is animated and explaining their vision for how the idea could work, laugh and suggest that it is completely impractical and you'll find an Aquarian quite as able to hold their vengeance for the rest of their lives. Oh they'll paint it differently, you'll see smiles and notice the odd sardonic comment and little disparaging observations from them, but nothing overt and they may not act upon their vengeance like Scorpio might, but it is there bubbling beneath the surface - the problem with Aquarius particularly is that when negative emotions arise (as they would in this situation) Aquarius will just 'logic' them under the carpet - in other words repress them to some level. They will want to appear and be 'above it'. But they may not be and chances are they won't be. Of the two, scorpio is definitely more dangerous, but Aquarius can become petty when their vision is dashed by a dose of realism.
                                • Re: Loyalty?

                                  Tue, July 28, 2009 - 10:05 AM
                                  Vengeance of crime suspect is bubbling beneath the surface? If aquarians don’t shake the earth like dangerous scorpion godzilla, what do they do? Twist-erase things….?!
                                  • Re: Loyalty?

                                    Tue, July 28, 2009 - 1:17 PM
                                    Paul, great Posts..I feel I am more of an evolved Scorpio asd the sign is broken up into 3 (sections) trines) I am an early Scorpio..born the day after Goldie Hawn and the Day before hillery Clinton...but not the year..lol..scorpios torwards the end of the sign I have found tend to be more or everything.
                                    • Re: Loyalty?

                                      Tue, July 28, 2009 - 2:40 PM
                                      Kalo

                                      Thanks for the friend invite btw, been really busy at work, but I will get around to looking at your chart properly and accepting it. Just kinda busy at work at the moment! (but get your chart from astro.com and put it in your pics!)

                                      "I feel I am more of an evolved Scorpio asd the sign is broken up into 3 (sections) trines) "

                                      Could you elaborate more?

                                      For me, I don't really like the terms 'evolved' as it implies a 'betterness' in something, and for me a betterness in one thing just indicates a weakness somewhere else. Maybe I'm cynical! ;p
                                      I think the hardest/greatest lesson for Scorpio to learn is forgiveness. Some Scorpios may say, easy, forgiving people is difficult but doable. Good for them, but they've misunderstood. The easiest step, which isn't all that easy in reality, is to forgive others. The truly hard part is to forgive themselves. Forgive themselves for not being perfect, for having gotten hurt, for getting angry, for hurting others. Forgive themselves for needing love and being vulnerable. It's a tough lesson to learn for the sign that fears emotional vulnerability more than any other. I don't claim to have done it myself, or necessarily be able to, but it IS the hardest and most valuable lesson for Scorpio. But of course there is a big difference in pointing to the road and walking it.
                                • Re: Loyalty?

                                  Tue, July 28, 2009 - 2:12 PM
                                  Scorpians tend to become a lot closer than most other signs in their relations, regular twins & watercups both will keep things on the surface (not degrading it, just stating it). The latter partnership is a far less explosive, more businesslike, when things fall apart. They often can just agree that they disagree & part with stiff smiles. When Scorpio has "raised" others, invited them into his life & "groomed" them with care just to see it all end in rejection of some kind, that will result in some serious bad weather. That´s the wrong day to be out at sea in a small boat, so to speak.
                                  • Re: Loyalty?

                                    Tue, July 28, 2009 - 2:29 PM
                                    "regular twins & watercups both will keep things on the surface (not degrading it, just stating it)"

                                    watercups?

                                    I agree that generally the twins keep things lighter, that's their way. However there's more to that sign that might be apparant on the surface of the twin's facade. Deep down the Twins are looking for just that - a twin. This is a huge part of the Gemini dynamic, often overlooked. Inside every Gemini is a deep yearning to be reunited with their 'mystical' missing twin. Gemini feels sorely the loss of their perfect missing other half, there is a sense to Gemini that it is only half alive or only half complete, and that there is another 'other' out there to fullfil them - their missing twin. Gemini is accused of superficiality - often not unfairly - however it would be foolish indeed to suggest that Gemini isn't capable of doing otherwise, it is simply that Gemini prefers lighter relationships, not that they can't do deeper ones. So why is this? It's simple, you're not their missing twin. When they find that twin, then you will see the depth of Gemini that would rival Scorpio in it's intensity - for Mercury himself was no stranger to the depths of Hades and was the guide. Pollux and Castor - the mystical twins. What a knowledge of astrology would reveal to every twin is that their missing and elusive twin is to be found in the depths of hades - the underworld, their deepest fears and darkest emotions, and also on mount olympus, their lofty notions and higher ideals. These are both sides to Gemini for gemini is THE dual sign. If this doesn't make sense, then imagine it in a more mundane setting. Inside every Gemini is the compulsion that there is somebody waiting for them 'out there' who will make them feel complete. How 'imperfect' are all others who do not match this? Why waste time on pretending to have deep feelings for anything less than this perfect union? So you will see the Gemini playing the flirt and perhaps sleeping around, but as soon as they find that twin, that's it, games over, put away the toys. No more superficiality, Gemini has found itself once again. All other signs are born whole, Gemini is born with its very soul cleaved in two and told, ok, you're half a person, now find the other half and complete yourself. Gemini has been to the depths of Hades and also the lofty heights of Olympus and knows that ultimately things aren't worth worrying over, the other twin IS out there. If only we could find them!

                                    Explaining Gemini

                                    Paul
                                  • Re: Loyalty?

                                    Tue, July 28, 2009 - 2:36 PM
                                    "When Scorpio has "raised" others, invited them into his life & "groomed" them with care just to see it all end in rejection of some kind, that will result in some serious bad weather. That´s the wrong day to be out at sea in a small boat, so to speak."

                                    I completely agree, it would not be a good time to be a small boat in a tempestuous ocean. And yet there is something fragile and vulnerable about Scorpio. All here who have scorpio in their chart must admit this to themselves even if not to others. There is something almost child like in its vulnerability. Often Sag is accused of having the 'grand notions', but really we might take a second look at scorpio and suggest the same. For scorpio, love is not some game, some fun feelings, some little buzz. For Aries Love means someone who makes me feel better about myself. Not for Scorpio, for scorpio Love means transcending life, death, union, their mammy, their daddy, their everything. It is nothing short of everything for Scorpio, emotion is all there is, frozen and preserved in perfection. Aries you may see falling in and out of love several times. Scorpio never falls out of love. It may even manage to convince itself otherwise, and often can turn that love sour into hate, but it is always there. Love never dies, Scorpio knows this. The catch is that Scorpio expects it of others, and therein lies the almost childlike assumption. There is something very fragile about it. It is frozen emotion, as though the sands of time slow down and the emotion is preserved just as it is. When in love there is no falling out of it. There is only the acceptance and hurt and loss of the lack of love and the learning curve of how to try and live with that - whether it be through melancholy or by turning love to anger and hate - but it always there. Other signs can 'get over' it quicker. Not scorpio and therein lies its vulnerability.
                                    For all the shrewdness of Scorpio, and all the clever mind games and psychological awareness (which it has in abundance) there is still some little child in every Scorpio that just wants nothing less than eternal love, if only others felt the same.
                                    • Unsu...
                                       

                                      Re: Loyalty?

                                      Tue, July 28, 2009 - 10:32 PM
                                      ''' Not for Scorpio, for scorpio Love means transcending life, death, union, their mammy, their daddy, their everything''

                                      ''''

                                      Love never dies, Scorpio knows this. The catch is that Scorpio expects it of others, and therein lies the almost childlike assumption. There is something very fragile about it. It is frozen emotion, as though the sands of time slow down and the emotion is preserved just as it is. When in love there is no falling out of it. There is only the acceptance and hurt and loss of the lack of love and the learning curve of how to try and live with that - whether it be through melancholy or by turning love to anger and hate - but it always there. Other signs can 'get over' it quicker. Not scorpio and therein lies its vulnerability.

                                      (tears)

                                      • This post was deleted by (unknown)
                                  • Re: Loyalty?

                                    Tue, July 28, 2009 - 2:41 PM
                                    "watercups"

                                    Ah Aquarius right? I get it now. Couldn't take my head away from the Tarot and was thinking the suit of cups - water signs.
                                    • Re: Loyalty?

                                      Tue, July 28, 2009 - 2:55 PM
                                      Paul, sorry to say evolved..but without a groomed spirituality to an extent even if that is "christianity" scopios can be quite "evil" lol and I use that term in jest..routhless and revengeful I guess...I read in an astrology magazine years ago how scorpio personality types were broken into 3 sections of dates ..the article gave astrological information and used stars as examples of scopio personality types that varied in degree and in persona..that is all I remember. Goldie hawn was the 1st group. Johnny Carson was the second group and Richard Burton was the third group. It was a reputable magazine and article..unfortunately I no longer have it.
                                      Perhaps it was all bunk. Can never tell.
                                      How lucky you are to be busy at work..me being unemployeed can only remember being that busy.
                                      I too wondered about that trins and "watercups"? wtf? lol
                                      Today I am depressed and weak..many reasons some may be astrological in nature.
                                      wishing you all a good day and evening and peace.
                                      Kalona'
                                      • Re: Loyalty?

                                        Tue, July 28, 2009 - 3:10 PM
                                        "Today I am depressed and weak..many reasons some may be astrological in nature. "

                                        One thing I would say on this subject is this:
                                        Astrology is NEVER the reason that we are depressed and weak. The answer to this weakness will not be found by looking to the stars and blaming one of them, it will always have to be found from within. Now there will be transits which coincide of course and there will always the law correspondance to contend with - as above so below. However it is not any planets doing. The planets are just symbols of the reality which is to be found within. I do not know your circumstance, I only glanced through the PM as I wanted to devote greater attention to it when I'm not distracted, however it seems to my initial impression that you are blaiming a transit or series of them. Life is not that symbol and blame is seldom adaquately portioned.Look to yourself. Sure, use astrology to help, but rather than suggest "ah! Saturn is transiting my MC" for example, look to your own natal chart first. Then look to transits and what they did last time they transitted, now look and think "what if I had doen things differently". You cannot look to the heavens and hope to speed up Saturn's (or whichever planet) transit. It will happen, just as slowly and in its own time as plant decide to take root and grow. What you can do is change your attitude. It seems pretty inoccuous and not worth mentioning, but it is a HUGE thing. Just change your attitude. You are not unemployed, you are seeking employment. Even that one change is crucial.

                                        Of course, we ARE in a time of financial hardship and we can see this play being performed in the heavens with Pluto's relentless onslaught into Capricorn, being just one transit. We're all feeling the crunch. But our attitudes and reactions to these transits are worth more than any other factor. What defines us most isn't necessarily the chart we've been given, no more than a good poker player is determined by the hand he is dealt. What we do with what we have, regardless of how little or great that is, is the true key to who we are. You are unemployed at the moment. That is all. Nothing in this alone suggests depression or weakness. Unemployment does not equate with depression, only your attitude toward it does. You are in a unique position now. You have free time on your hands. How are you using it? To seek work probably, and that is natural. However you coudl also use this time to learn a new skill. We're no longer lilving in an age where we can hide behind ignorance. We have, at our fingertips, access to almost limitless knowledge. You could reserach something, write a book, start a diary or learn new skills - you could learn almost anything these days online, or go one better and learn something about the web itself. You could learn web-design skills, you can get free software on the open-source market to help you. You can do, basically, anything you want to. Only you are choosing to remain depressed and weak. Exercise, go for a light jog, do some aerobic training, choose a hobby or topic and pursue it more. You are unemployed for the moment, that is all, you are not dying or sick. take your life in your hands and shape what you will out of it. Use astrology as a tool for understanding yourself, not as a tool for hiding from yourself.
                                        I don't mean this in any harsh way, I'm trying to give you the best advice I can in a way that I hope will make an impact.

                                        I quote this all the time so forgive me if you've read it before:
                                        "Have patience with all things, but chiefly have patience with yourself.
                                        Do not lose courage in considering your own imperfections - but instantly set upon remedying them!
                                        Every day, begin the task anew".
                                    • Re: Loyalty?

                                      Tue, July 28, 2009 - 3:15 PM
                                      Scorps really do all that stuff just because they are in the mood for some love? Perhaps they just like to acquire more personal items than most others...like people? Some like bowling trophies in their bookcases, scorps perhaps prefer human trophies? Being rather dysfunctional when it comes to all things involving any type of romance, I honestly don´t know.
                                      • Re: Loyalty?

                                        Tue, July 28, 2009 - 6:05 PM
                                        Twins holding watercups can surely paint a pretty picture without much emotion involved. The seductive singing of the Sirens that I have warned over and over again is sounding louder and louder, heightened to the word of eternal love, which exists nowhere but the heads of naive sailors. Tossing around in boredom the dead bodies like volleyball on the flowery island of Anthemoessa, the twin Sirens of the river god crave more toys!
                                        • Re: Loyalty?

                                          Wed, July 29, 2009 - 3:13 AM
                                          "Twins holding watercups can surely paint a pretty picture without much emotion involved"

                                          Laux

                                          I think you seriously misunderstand the 'twins' and the 'watercups'.

                                          It's also worth not throwing away the message because you dislike the messenger.
                                          • Re: Loyalty?

                                            Wed, July 29, 2009 - 6:35 AM
                                            That was mantic Cancerian Circe’s prophecy on certain twins holding watercups..!
                                            The Sirens screamed, “ you ignored my singing just because you dislike me!” The prophetic horrid scene of the dead sailors scattered all over the florid island..! Where are the Muses who can pluck out all of the Sirens’ feathers?
                                            • Re: Loyalty?

                                              Wed, July 29, 2009 - 11:35 AM
                                              Paul,
                                              "Now there will be transits which coincide..." coincidence..and I do not believe in coincidence at all personally ...Not at all..Life has taight me that. And you mentioned..I am not sick, when in fact I have been..may be the stress triggered it but I have been sick..as far as dying? (shrugs) I live in the USA and the doctor ordered blood tests..and then more tests..I skipped the more tests because in the good ol USA tests cost money and money I do not have..so there you have it..could be dying.
                                              As far as scorpios collecting trophies weather people or whatever...I do not do this. I'd rather have a couple loyal friends than be a popular guy.However, neither is in existence right now.
                                              Perspective. I am unemployeed....I am seeking work ...that is just Syntax to me.... Ihave bills I cannot pat...oh an oppertunity for me to be constructive in this challenge..no it is all Syntax to me..especially since I live alone and they shut off my Tv and I have no gas to drive and so forth and so on.....scorpios may use words like a lawyer and I am indeed guilty of that (having analytical minds) but perspective cannot be changed so readily..not for this scorpio anyway. Most people have one of these things: a friend, a family, a career, a love, secutity,....(if there is any among you taht live alone like I do without any of these things speak up) I have non of these to back me up..and so truly standing on ones own without the formentioned...well, no man can truly be an island.
                                              I consider what I am going through weather it be Karmic, astrological or whatever, hard, earthsaddering, and singulary mind blowing.
                                              Why, because all loyalty has been broken..even loyaty to a belief system maybe.
                                              The saying goes, don't judge a man until you have been for a walk in his moccasins.
                                              Perhaps part of the lesson I am learning..is that it doesn't matter if no one else understands or can relate to make something real? or perhaps my lesson is illusions can kill..personally..I am over the dogma of reasons or lessons or planets..all this scopio knows is "this is painful"
                                              • Re: Loyalty?

                                                Wed, July 29, 2009 - 1:52 PM
                                                "Perhaps part of the lesson I am learning..is that it doesn't matter if no one else understands or can relate to make something real? or perhaps my lesson is illusions can kill..personally..I am over the dogma of reasons or lessons or planets..all this scopio knows is "this is painful""

                                                I'm not about telling others what their life lessons are. I do not readily know my own to tell others of theirs. My only point was that the transits in and of themselves are not the cause, they are merely the catalyst. Perhaps this doesn't help your situation, perhaps it does. I do not know.

                                                It seems you have a full CV so why you are not getting employed is beyond me. Perhaps the presentation may say something. Have you tried going on websites that offer advice on how to format your CV to be more up to date and appealing? For example most employers prefer a one-page CV or at most a two-page CV. Anything more than that they often disregard. These little tips can be worth knowing.
                                                • Re: Loyalty?

                                                  Wed, July 29, 2009 - 3:12 PM
                                                  Paul 1 page reume or 2 page resume yes..a CV by definition is extended and yes I have tried this. Was just applying for work..10 more job aps...."they are merely the catalyst" if the catalyst of say a intruder into a mans house threastening the lives of his family...duh well of course he is going to shoot if he has a gun..some catalysts leave little room for choice.
                                                  I know I am hard to understand and my situation is akin to the twighlight zone..sureal.
                                                  I do thank you for your support and helpful looks into possibilities.
                                                  I have even moved to CA once in search of that GOOD JOB..Iwas told I was overqualified..now in the USA all applications or most ask for your social security number....making it impossible to tone down or lie about your application or job history.
                                                  YOU HAVE TO KNOW SOMEONE these days and all jobs are seemingly going to women..or men can get manual labor..and I have applied to some of those as well..even Janitor. I have 10 versions of my CV in shapes and sizes....still nothing.
                                                  So, I am LOST..for whatever reason. I feel like JOB in the Bible..only not so dogmatic or faithful. I do believ in a higher being but Damn enough is enough. thanks again for your imput and advice.
                                                  I am a loyal scorpio to a fault and I don't give up..but everyone does has his or her limits.
                                      • Re: Loyalty?

                                        Wed, July 29, 2009 - 2:55 AM
                                        "Scorps really do all that stuff just because they are in the mood for some love?"

                                        Yes ultimately I believe that. I don't for a moment suggest that it is a concious decision of theirs of course. Ultimately Scorpio is looking for love - love that cannot die. Scorpio wants to be loved not only in spite of all its faults, but because of them as well. Of course cold hard reality doesn't often marry this ideology particularly well and hardship and heartache is often the result. The side effects of these things are often the 'traits' we see in sun-sign books.

                                        "scorps perhaps prefer human trophies? "

                                        The fixed signs are undoubtedly the collectors and perhaps this is true of scorpio too. I don't know. Personally I have noticed it more in the other fixed signs - particularly Leo and Taurus - than the others, but I guess it's true of them all?
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
                    Unsu...
                     

                    Re: Loyalty?

                    Mon, July 27, 2009 - 10:54 AM
                    well good morning, Joakim. I was just asking some questions for introspection, no big deal, i assure you. :)
              • Re: Loyalty?

                Mon, July 27, 2009 - 1:45 AM
                Scale and rulers are good. Usually those word-twisting social chameleons should be on the negative side.
                • Re: Loyalty?

                  Mon, July 27, 2009 - 5:09 AM
                  Ah, mrs Laux. Still no sightings of that moth? We can relax without anticipating the regal flapping sound of its wings?
                  • This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.

                    Re: Loyalty?

                    Mon, July 27, 2009 - 6:49 AM
                    And do the crime suspects come after the smart investigators trying to twisterase (twist & erase) traces of evidences? Phew, we can relax for now.
                    • Re: Loyalty?

                      Mon, July 27, 2009 - 6:52 AM
                      Oopse, I posted this without looking a few floors above my head
                      • Re: Loyalty?

                        Mon, July 27, 2009 - 10:32 AM
                        Paul yes veriables do come into play and I would add money to the list you gave...money or security or both
                        • Re: Loyalty?

                          Mon, July 27, 2009 - 10:38 AM
                          I would also like to note that we are currently in a "me" dominated society and the "we" generation is all but gone.
                          If you ever go on Face Book, you would see just how much "me" comes into play...so the "I" "me" "my" of it all would definately fit into the catigory of loyalty.
  • Re: Loyalty?

    Fri, August 7, 2009 - 1:25 PM
    Being very loyal to friends,colleagues,work,home,

    I want to get same from all ,

    and when there is someone who is just too much of a traitor ,

    he directly is signed out of my life circle .

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